Step 3: Who gets to vote + DRAFT

Post content relevant to Guild Wars. This includes, but is not limited to: screenshots, guides, tutorials, questions & answers, etc.
Cruz
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 2:29 am
In-game name: Ashei Cruz
Guild: IT

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote and are votes weighted?

Post by Cruz »

Flo wrote:Also, I think we should stop the practice of "this stuff is forbidden" and instead move towards "this stuff is allowed". So when a new thing comes around it needs to be allowed and not forbidden. This prevents confusion about whether a new tool is accepted in records without having an unsatisfying transition period.
So you want to rewrite rule 8?

Flo
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1366
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:23 pm
In-game name: Hi Im Undercover
Guild: Golt

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote and are votes weighted?

Post by Flo »

Well I would make it one question in the vote.

It seems pretty reasonable to me to have a new tool allowed before doing a record with it - just assuming "it will be fine" is pretty problematic and in my opinion was a big reason the minimap discussion esclated like this. People just started using it and were obviosuly mad when it was forbidden.

Anyways, this doesnt really belong here, because its contentual already.

Flo
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1366
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:23 pm
In-game name: Hi Im Undercover
Guild: Golt

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote and are votes weighted?

Post by Flo »

Since it seems to be a hard concept to grasp for some people, I ll go a little more into detail here.
Nika just started pulling his usual bullshit again and people (again) claim there is "only one solution" blabla.

IF YOU HAVE AN OPINION JUST FUCKING VOTE FOR IT. Dont make retarded claims aka "others are ruining the community" or whatever, dont act like you re the only one who bases their opinion on "facts" and dont act like fucking retards in general.


Now back to this. I ll give you some ideas of what I PERSONALLY (not in my function as a mod) think how we should handle the most important aspects of this vote.

1. Should everyone be allowed to vote?
NO. Imo there has to be some requirements, aka "account exqists for at least one year", has created at least 5 posts in the last 2 years.
You cant let everybody vote and expect it to be representative of the community as is.

2. Should mods be allowed to vote?
I think they should NOT. Imo mods should provide the question that get voted on, but not be able to vote themselves. Separation of power bitches.

This is so simple and yet so hard for some people to understand. YES, we can discuss potential manipulation. YES, we can disagree about which people should be allowed. NO, we should not just enforce every rule we personally like. NO, we should not claim our opinion is the only true one. AND FOR FUCKS SAKE there is MORE THAN ONE SOLUTION TO THIS PROBLEM so just express your opinion in a vote and not in another randomr retarded way.

Nika
Posts: 616
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:07 am
In-game name: Nika Iz Back
Guild: [SenT]

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote and are votes weighted?

Post by Nika »

Call me out on my bullshit and where i crossed the rules and i'll respect it.

We should vote for a few ppl who make the rules :)

Flo
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1366
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:23 pm
In-game name: Hi Im Undercover
Guild: Golt

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote and are votes weighted?

Post by Flo »

@Misty in other topic

You dont get it Misty. You have no "vote" in what Nika is saying, because its just his own opinions he would be enforcing. You might agree with that 1 point and disagree with 3 others (or reversed, but thats just a game of chance) and you would have absolutely no say in anything. You should really think about if you want to support that.

@all

On a related note, "if noone has any counterarguments, i'd suggest my plan will be put into place from tomorrow on". Thats how it works right?

No srsly, does someone want to make any objection regarding my points two posts ago?

Misty
Posts: 560
Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:19 am
In-game name: ____ of the Owls
Guild: Illumination Theory [IT]

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote and are votes weighted?

Post by Misty »

idk why you didn't respond in that topic but if we're talking about it here: I didn't mean to imply that me "voting" gave Nika any power he doesn't already have. I was just saying I agree with his approach. I believe Nika has actually tried to be reasonable and respect what people wanted. That may not be democratic but it's better than letting people enforce a decision without being bound by any reason at all. I trust Nika more than I trust the average member of this community.

In response to your thing about voting, I don't think mods should be excluded from voting. I think everyone who is qualified should be a mod, and nobody else should have a vote.
Flo wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:56 am
Sadly, Misty is right.

Flo
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1366
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:23 pm
In-game name: Hi Im Undercover
Guild: Golt

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote + DRAFT

Post by Flo »

I edited the first post to cover the following draft of what a vote could look like. This is not final. Post questions and answers you think are missing and we ll probably add them.
The formatting is pretty fucked since gwscr doesnt know tabs.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is a DRAFT (18.05.2017 9:31). DONT VOTE HERE, but you can give your feedback, ask for questions to be added or things to be rephrased.
You can only vote for questions that are in brackets -> [ ].
As a general guideline, people that have been signed up for at least 3 months and have at least 5 posts in the last 2 years are considered active members of the community (this is still subject of discussion, but I think this covers pretty much everyone while preventing manipulation to a good extend).

Public vote for GWSCR changes
1. Category: Legitimisation
[1.1] Do you agree with the way this vote is held and therefore with its results? (Yes/No)
NOTE: If more than 50% vote "No", we as moderators would probably have to determine the rules ourselves.
[1.2] Do you accept the basic population determined by the above mentionen rules to be representative? (Yes/No)
[1.3] Should only things that are specifically allowed be allowed? (Yes/No)
NOTE: "Yes" means that things have to be allowed before they eligible to be used in a record. "No" means that everything should be allowed that isnt forbidden.
2. Category: General Structure of Records
NOTE: You may only vote for one of the general solutions (2.1/2.2/2.3/2.4/2.5) with "Yes", but for all of the subordinite questions in case the general solution you support doesnt end up getting a majority.
[2.1] Current System composed of pure (no 3rd party allowed at all), standard (some 3rd party are allowed while some others arent) and tas (all 3rd party allowed) (Yes/No)
NOTE: The following answers are only relevant if 2.1 or 2.4 happen to get a majority over the other options - you should vote here in case this happens.
[2.1.1] Should Texmod be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.2] Should health bar trackers be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.3] Should distance trackers be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.4] Should macros to execute multiple inputs (for example press skills 1-5 at the same time) be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.5] Should auto-pcons be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.6] Should hotkeys for items be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.7] Should hotkeys for movement be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.8] Should hotkeys for targetting be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.9] Should tools to interrupt (for example with ymlad) be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.1.10] Should toolbox minimap be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
[2.2] New System composed of only pure and tas (Yes/No)
[2.2.1] Should old records be sorted into the new categorys retroactively? (Yes/No)
[2.3] New System composed of only pure (Yes/No)
[2.3.1] Should old records be sorted into the new categorys retroactively? (Yes/No)
[2.4] New system composed of only standard (Yes/No)
NOTE: In case 2.4 gets a majority, the answers subordinate to 2.1 will be taken to determine the 2.4 ruleset. (Yes/No)
[2.4.1] Should old records be sorted into the new categorys retroactively? (Yes/No)
[2.5] New system composed of only tas (Yes/No)
[2.5.1] Should old records be sorted into the new categorys retroactively? (Yes/No)
3. Category: Videos and Screenshots
3.1 Category: Amount of videos required
NOTE: You may only vote for one of the options with "Yes"
[3.1.1] Records require every single partymember to provide a video. (Yes/No)
[3.1.2] Records require more than half of the party members to provide a video (so in case of 7 party members 4 videos, in case of 2 party members 2 videos) (Yes/No)
[3.1.2] Records require one video. (Yes/No)
[3.2] Independent from 3.1, does every split (=split up for more than 30 seconds and/or for questionable tasks) have to be captured in at least one video? (Yes/No)
3.3 Category: Approving based on videos
NOTE: You may only vote for one of the options with "Yes"
[3.3.1] One mod has to see at least the amount of videos set in 3.1 (Yes/No)
[3.3.2] More than one mid has to see at least the amount of videos set in 3.1 (Yes/No)
[3.3.3] One video per record has to be public (Yes/No)
[3.3.4] All videos have to be public (Yes/No)

Ether
Posts: 388
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2014 5:47 pm
In-game name: Gate of Anguish
Guild: Loa

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote + DRAFT

Post by Ether »

[2.1.10] Should toolbox minimap be allowed in standard? (Yes/No).
Is that really all to the question? Considering there are many parts to the minimap, wouldn't it make more sense to vote on what exactly should/shouldn't be allowed?
[2.1.1] Should Texmod be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
Texmod? What about umod? Is using a UI overhaul allowed? What if they provide some benefit (fiend texmod)? Is TB minimap considered a texmod considering it revamps the compass?
[2.1.8] Should hotkeys for targetting be allowed in standard? (Yes/No)
If this votes yes, but a TB minimap vote is no, what would you do?
BTW, none of this can be enforced unless everyone is required to record, and the videos are public.

Flo
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 1366
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 4:23 pm
In-game name: Hi Im Undercover
Guild: Golt

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote + DRAFT

Post by Flo »

Good points, I ll edit those into the first post when I get home.
One question to the texmod/umod thing though: Everything could be considered an advantage (slimmer UI for more visibility, spirit range, health markers, colours of enemies), so where would you draw the line? For me every texmod is the same.

And yeah, thats an issue. We re never going to get 100% confirmation though, not even with videos from everyone. But we can try and atleast make it better than it was before.

Befi
Posts: 157
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2012 1:16 pm
In-game name: Befi Goes Ele
Guild: [hC]

Re: Step 3: Who gets to vote + DRAFT

Post by Befi »

too much text

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 155 guests