Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

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Flo
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Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Flo » Tue Jan 17, 2017 11:35 am

Hello my fellow GWSCR users, Frenchies, nice people and Andrew.

For those of you who dont know, in September several of us had a discussion about possible changes to the GWSCR ruleset. After only 2 months of meditation, I managed to do more than Nika in his whole mod-life and set up this poll to figure out how to proceed.

We came to the following decisions (a new idea is implemented, if 3 or more our of the 5 mods agreed with it):

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Splitting the rules regarding 3rd party tools in 3 different categories (only for elite areas, only 1 month as a test)

The 3 categories are the following: PURE, STANDARD and TOOL-ASSISTED (TAS)

PURE:
-no modifications to the client are allowed (no texmod, no injection)
-exception: an ingame-timer
-posting a record in this category will require EVERY party member to provide a full video

STANDARD:
-this is the current ruleset
-cient modifications and injections that allow you to automate / simplify ingame-actions that could also be done with an unmodified client are allowed
For example, allowed are: texmods, using pcons, a hotkey for an item, a hotkey for chat-commands, a movement macro (NEW)
For example, not allowed are: targetting gitb, targetting per enemy/ally id, taking a questreward while the ally is in combat, taking a quest you could normally not without completing prequests, using toolbox minimap (NEW)
-posting a record in this category will require 1 video per split. Its okay if people lose sight of eachother for a few seconds, but if you re separated for ~30 seconds, you need a video.

TOOL-ASSISTED (TAS):
-do whatever the fuck you want
-posting a record in this category will require 1 video per split. Its okay if people lose sight of eachother for a few seconds, but if you re separated for ~30 seconds, you need a video.

If you post a record in the PURE or TAS category, you ve to mention it in the title.

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If the new categories arent used, we ll revoke the changes. If there is great demand, we will continue with it and might extend the new system to dungeon records as well.

Until then, dungeon records and mission records come within the STANDARD ruleset.

Now, tell us how retarded we are. Flame on!

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Cruz » Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:29 pm

I am happy with these changes. Looking at your votes it seemed like you guys wanted to disallow the tb map entirely, I'm happy you didn't!
Could you explain the reasoning behind allowing movement macros, but disallowing id/map targeting in the standard section?

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Flo » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:02 pm

Well fuck, thats awkward. Because we actually intended to ban the minimap completely, ty for noticing i made a mistake in the first post.

I can explain MY reasoning voting the way i did:
I voted no for movement macros, because you literally cant detect if someone used it. If you set a rule, there has to be a way to enforce it. While i see the same problem for targetting, tb is the most prominent way to do so. I didnt want to differentiate between 2 different ways of targetting, so i voted no for both. Dunno why the others voted the way they did.

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Misty » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:05 pm

This looks good - some faith in the mods is restored <3 just a few questions for clarification:

1. No videos are required for TAS runs? We just have to submit one screenshot with /age, F11, and U map?
2. Are those standard rules now in effect for dungeon and mission records?
3. "Its okay if people lose sight of eachother for a few seconds, but if you re separated for more than 30 seconds, you need a video." <--- is that 30 seconds a hard rule, or is it based on the mods' discretion whether or not the invisible split was for too long?
Flo wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:56 am
Sadly, Misty is right.

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Flo » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:12 pm

1. No, the 1 video per split rule still applies to TAS runs. I ll add it above
2. Yes
3. mods discretion, but 30 seconds should be a good benchmark. Just dont be off-screen for several minutes and you ll most likely be fine.

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Misty » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:24 pm

Flo wrote:Well fuck, thats awkward. Because we actually intended to ban the minimap completely, ty for noticing i made a mistake in the first post.

I can explain MY reasoning voting the way i did:
I voted no for movement macros, because you literally cant detect if someone used it. If you set a rule, there has to be a way to enforce it. While i see the same problem for targetting, tb is the most prominent way to do so. I didnt want to differentiate between 2 different ways of targetting, so i voted no for both. Dunno why the others voted the way they did.
Dude... did you even ask the other mods if they meant that? You can EASILY enforce no targeting with the minimap... it's clearly visible when someone does it.
Flo wrote:the 1 video per split rule still applies to TAS runs
Why? o_O_o surely just 1 video should be enough?
Flo wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:56 am
Sadly, Misty is right.

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Ether » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:41 pm

whats the point of videos for TAS when the whole point is to 'cheat'. arent videos supposed to be used to prevent cheating

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Flo » Tue Jan 17, 2017 4:44 pm

If you inject 20 things into your client you can run a recording program as well...
But i dont disagree with you though, its a topic for further discussion. But so far we ve voted and the results are 5x"Yes" in favor of 1 video per split, so i am not going to mess with that.
(Also, PURE requires a video from every person, thats how we discussed it in November. I think you agree it makes sense)

How can you misunderstand the question "Should tb minimap be allowed in standard?" Right, you cant.

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Ether » Tue Jan 17, 2017 5:02 pm

ok well im going to keep using the minimap but dont record, and i will be doing a role that doesnt require me to split anywhere, and when i do screenshot i will just turn off the minimap overlay.

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Re: Results of the vote: Ruleset-changes

Postby Misty » Tue Jan 17, 2017 6:26 pm

Flo wrote:If you inject 20 things into your client you can run a recording program as well...
I'm pretty sure Toolbox++ is less demanding than even a very basic video recorder, but in any case this assumes that TAS runs require all splits to be using hacks, which is silly... only one person needs to be using them =P anyway, there is no good reason they should be required to make all of their tactics public simply because they CAN record.
Flo wrote:i dont disagree with you
Flo wrote:the results are 5x"Yes" in favor of 1 video per split
This contradiction just proves that your voting system is simplistic =P
Flo wrote:How can you misunderstand the question "Should tb minimap be allowed in standard?" Right, you cant.
Well there was no option for "allow the minimap but no targeting", so any reasonable person might just assume that's what the question meant. After all, banning the entire minimap just to stop one of its functions is ludicrous.
Flo wrote:
Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:56 am
Sadly, Misty is right.


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